Jay's Dual Tech system

HeroicJay · 2015-10-27T15:13:35+0900

THIS PLUGIN IS NO LONGER AVAILABLE IN THIS FORUM A dual tech allows two characters to join forces and combine their skills into one more powerful skill. However, the use of one requires you to spend the cost of both characters' composite skills, so it can get quite MP (or TP) costly! To use it, just enter the following into the Note box of any skill: You can add more actors (up to ten, though you'll need an extra plugin to use more than four in battle, of course) by just listing them after Actor2's details and before HitRate. Make sure the parameters (other than HitRate, if you use it) always come in pairs; one for the actor ID and one for the skill. The ActorIDs should be their database ID numbers; the Skills can either be skill names or ID numbers. So: will work, so long as actor #1 learns Fire and actor #2 learns Ice. "HitRate" is optional, and accepts the following values: "user" - Uses the hit rate for the actor that used the skill. "first" or "actor1" - Uses the hit rate for the actor defined by Actor1ID. "second" or "actor2" - Uses the hit rate for the actor defined by Actor2ID. (You can go up to actor10, but only "first" and "second" are defined by written-out ordinal numbers.) "highest" - Between all actors, select the highest hit rate. "lowest" - Between all actors, select the lowest hit rate. NOTE: I have disabled the "sum" HitRate, since it doesn't really make a lot of sense even for two characters, and certainly not for more than that. If you don't set a HitRate, the hit rate will be the same as if you set it to "user". Magical and Certain Hit skills ignore hit rates anyway, so you may as well not bother with HitRate for those. For the damage formulae of dual and triple tech skills, you may refer to the actors with "c", "d", etc., with "c" being the first actor defined in the tag, "d" the second, and so on up to "l" (lowercase L). "a" still works for the one who initiated the skill, and "b" is, as always, the target. THINGS TO NOTE: For the time being, this dualtech script only uses the turn of one character (in fact, both associated characters can use the dualtech skill in the same turn, if they both can and you can afford the cost!) As dualtechs are (at least at present) tied to specific actors, you'll have to make new versions for different pairings, even if they know the same skills. Each party member has to learn the dualtech ability on their own. So if you want both party members calling it, teach both of them the dualtech skill. If you want one character to always initiate it, give it only to that one. However, the dualtech will only appear when the composite spells are learned and both characters are in the party, so feel free to teach every single one at level 1 if you don't want to have special unlock conditions for them. If you want to break the dependency of a dualtech on another tech, set it as a component to itself. This can be done for either or both of the actors defined in the skill. If you do this, the actor will use any MP or TP costs (or any other costs from plugins) associated with the dualtech skill in the database. Otherwise, the actor will ignore those costs and only spend the cost of the component skill. You can also teach the skill to a character not defined in the tag, which will (for that actor alone) treat the user as a part of the tech, and the user's "component" will be the tech itself. If you do this, however, it is not recommended to define the tech as a component for itself for any other actor. It lists the actors' names in the skill cost, which can get really, really unwieldy. To combat this, if you define Game_Actor.icon() to return icon IDs for each actor, you'll get icons instead. Down below, I have a small snippet of code that can do this for you (but there are other, more flexible ways to do it.) Or you can use the cycle parameters, mentioned below. This script is now fully compatible with Yanfly's SkillCore 1.01 and SkillCooldowns 1.02a! For compatibility purposes, please put this plugin below all plugins that modify skill cost or skill cost display in any fashion (plugins that do this that I'm aware of are the two aforementioned Yanfly plugins and Unconnected42's Ammunition plugin.) If you are using skill costs that come from a universal resource pool (in other words, something the entire party can access like money or items, not something individual like HP, MP, or TP) it is heavily recommended that you do not give the same type of cost to multiple actors for the same dualtech! (For instance, it is not recommended that Actor 1 uses a skill that uses up one Potion and Actor 2 uses a skill that uses up two Potions. If you have exactly two Potions, the plugin will actually let you use the skill and wind up with negative one Potions.) If the cost for each actor comes from a different pool (like A…

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Started by HeroicJay Oct 27, 2015, 06:13 AM 329 posts Page 16 of 17 View original ↗

HeroicJay

#302 Jan 28, 2021, 10:03 PM Source

It IS available. Just not here any more.
ScytheX

#303 Jan 28, 2021, 10:18 PM Source

HeroicJay said:
It IS available. Just not here any more.
is there a site where it is or do we have to get it from someone?
studwb22

#304 Jan 28, 2021, 10:48 PM Source

Is it on Itch.io?
HeroicJay

#305 Jan 29, 2021, 05:12 AM Source

I've been ordered not to link to it because of advertising rules or something. But... well, I'm not exactly denying what studwb22 suggests.
studwb22

#306 Jan 29, 2021, 05:15 AM Source

HeroicJay said:
Strictly speaking, I've been told not to say. But I won't say it isn't there.
Gotcha
ScytheX

#307 Jan 29, 2021, 10:11 PM Source

not sure whats with all the "clock and dagger" about this is there something wrong with it that it has to treated like top secret codes to a nuclear bomb? XD
HeroicJay

#308 Jan 29, 2021, 10:34 PM Source

I hate doing it, but I was warned about linking to my shop - even in my own topics - in the past and now I'm just trying to avoid more of that.
Zakarijazh

#309 Jan 30, 2021, 01:11 PM Source

HeroicJay said:
I hate doing it, but I was warned about linking to my shop - even in my own topics - in the past and now I'm just trying to avoid more of that.
I LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOVE the Dual Tech plugin!!!

(but you should put a disclaimer in the beginning that says your plugins are no longer available through this page, so people calm tf down. lol)
HeroicJay

#310 Jan 30, 2021, 10:08 PM Source

Zakarijah said:
I LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOVE the Dual Tech plugin!!!

(but you should put a disclaimer in the beginning that says your plugins are no longer available through this page, so people calm tf down. lol)

... I thought I did. I must have been thinking of another plugin's topic.
zelanius

#311 Jan 31, 2021, 06:23 AM Source

@HeroicJay just wanted to ask:
1. any plans to port the plugin over to MZ?
2. any plans to update the plugin to make it compatible with more plugins (e.g. SRD Skill Extender when used in conjunction with YEP Battle Status Window)?
HeroicJay

#312 Jan 31, 2021, 07:59 PM Source

I don't presently have MZ. If I get MZ in the future, there's a good chance.

I don't plan to look at every single plugin that exists to check that it's compatible and add compatibility - just too many out there! - but perhaps if I understood the problem better I could give it a try.
zelanius

#313 Feb 2, 2021, 04:49 PM Source

HeroicJay said:
I don't presently have MZ. If I get MZ in the future, there's a good chance.

I don't plan to look at every single plugin that exists to check that it's compatible and add compatibility - just too many out there! - but perhaps if I understood the problem better I could give it a try.
Hopefully, you might find a way to do turn linking without YEP Battle Status Window too...but I think that might be just wishful thinking on my part.
HeroicJay

#314 Feb 2, 2021, 06:21 PM Source

No, I've considered it, and the DTB is not a good choice of battle system for turn-linked dualtechs. The Battle Status Window changes the battle system just enough to make it feasible, and even then I wound up tweaking it further (having the Dualtech plugin slightly changes how the BSW DBT works.)
zelanius

#315 Feb 2, 2021, 06:48 PM Source

Interesting. It looks like DTB might be ideal for dual-techs, because everyone acts in the same turn, so hearing that it is not a good choice sounds a bit counter-intuitive, especially since Irina has the Unison Attack plugin, which is slightly similar in function.
HeroicJay

#316 Feb 2, 2021, 07:46 PM Source

Among my concerns in the true DTB:

- Either only the characters at the TOP of the lineup can activate dualtechs, or characters at the bottom of the lineup will "stomp" the commands you already gave the people at the top of the lineup.
- If you take the "stomping" solution, then that issue becomes compounded if character #1 activates a dualtech involving character #2, the system properly skips #2's turn, and then character #3 activates a dualtech involving character #1. Does character #2 just do nothing that turn? The DTB is not designed to "rewind" without canceling everyone's turns, and it would probably be confusing to a player who doesn't realize what they did.
- Speaking of, if characters #1 and #3 have a dualtech lined up, you're on character #4's turn, and you press the "cancel" button, what does it do? Does it cancel the dualtech and give you character #3's commands? Back up to character #2's turn? Back up to character #1's turn? All make some level of sense.

A solution I've seen to that issue was someone making all dualtechs "instant actions" that put a paralysis effect on everyone involved with the tech, but this is NOT a one-size-fits-all solution.

The reason the YEP BSW alleviates these problems (well, there's still the first issue; I went with the "stomping" approach, since the plugin shows an icon for the skill each actor has assigned, meaning it will be less of a surprise) is that it lets you assign moves out-of-order. And my tweak is that assigning a move to character #4 (or whoever is last) doesn't automatically start the turn if anyone hasn't been assigned a move yet, which is how the BSW usually works (you can still start a turn early, though.)

I have no idea how Irina deals with this; I didn't look into Unison Attacks very much.
zelanius

#317 Feb 3, 2021, 10:35 AM Source

Thanks for the explanation. I can properly appreciate why DTB is not good for Dualtechs at all.
METACHASER

#318 Mar 28, 2021, 11:55 PM Source

Is there a thread or website with pre-made dualtech scripts that work with this plugin and also the Yanfly action Sequence Plugins?
zelanius

#319 Apr 2, 2021, 05:05 PM Source

@HeroicJay do you plan to port this plugin over to RMMZ in the future? Just asking as I am seriously looking into moving to MZ, although that might take a year or so before I truly move over from MV.
zelanius

#320 Jul 29, 2021, 01:18 PM Source

@HeroicJay I recently got to thinking about the DTB issues, and was wondering if it would be possible to add a plugin function that can check if an actor has available actions or has available turns, and if not, the skill will be greyed out and not be selectable. On top of that, if a DualTech is selected and cancelled later, then it will clear the actions of both actors.

An alternative is that I think Yanfly's Skill Core can actually be used to check if a skill can be used, the problem would be the script call to use to check if both/all actors is in battle, can act and have not selected an action. I will try to find it when I get back to my game (I am on hiatus of sorts due to RL getting in the way).
HeroicJay

#321 Jul 29, 2021, 06:20 PM Source

zelanius said:
@HeroicJay I recently got to thinking about the DTB issues, and was wondering if it would be possible to add a plugin function that can check if an actor has available actions or has available turns, and if not, the skill will be greyed out and not be selectable. On top of that, if a DualTech is selected and cancelled later, then it will clear the actions of both actors.

An alternative is that I think Yanfly's Skill Core can actually be used to check if a skill can be used, the problem would be the script call to use to check if both/all actors is in battle, can act and have not selected an action. I will try to find it when I get back to my game (I am on hiatus of sorts due to RL getting in the way).

I already have it solved for DTB, but it requires a Yanfly plugin (Battle Status Window) to work.

What you suggest basically means that people toward the bottom of the character list cannot select dualtechs, which I considered an undesirable outcome. I was looking for a solution that didn't require any sort of silliness on the part of the player, like Defending to use dualtechs, if that's what you're trying to suggest. It needs to be intuitive.

The reason Battle Status Window works with turn-linked dualtechs is because it lets you select the characters' actions out-of-order, which is really the ONLY way to avoid the myriad problems that had me originally refuse to program turn linking in DTB without putting in special rules and exceptions that not all players or developers might like.