The most annoying RPG concept.....

In my opinion the most annoying RPG concept is when the game adds a temporary party member and if he or she dies then you automatically get a game over. In many cases this party member is also very weak. To make matters worse the developer will make a boss strong enough to kill this character in one hit.

I've played some RPGs that have this concept. It is happens often in the early Final Fantasy games. Final Fantasy VI is the most annoying with Banon.

Have you used this concept in a game? Why did you do this to just piss off the player? What type of responses did you receive for doing this?

If I remember correctly, Banon has a sweet healing move that makes it fairly easy to keep him alive. But speaking to your larger point, I don't mind this scenario in RPGs. I think its nice to have variety and different 'objectives', even within battles. I kind of like the strategy change from just 'Kill everything in sight.' But I also understand why some players might find it annoying.

Well...I mean I can reason with you somewhat. Having enemies one shot you with just a normal attack is pretty ty, unless your under-leveled, then it's your fault. On a BOSS however, having them be able to one hit you adds a lot of tension and strategy.

For example, you have a mage, no defense, give her a status boost to defense!

Another thing to consider is how the battle flows. Most boss battles flow the same direction. Attempt strategy 'A', strategy 'A' fails, attempt strategy 'B', strategy 'B' fails. This goes on and on until you find a decent strategy. Now for the rest of the battle you will use the same exact strategy every turn because it WORKS. You have a guaranteed win! But..uh-oh! Boss kills one of your characters! Cycle is broken, and you have to go apeshit and heal your party back up. Adds tension and intensity to boss battles.

Basically while it is annoying, it is a very good addition to strategy. Calling it a 'concept' is a push. It's not there to piss a player off it's there to add depth.

I've never seen this mechanic in a game where the character dies so fast that you lose just due to RNG multiple times in a row. I remember Banon, I never raged at it.

The only concept I can think of that really made me mad was one game where the requirement for the ultimate weapon was your starter weapon. There were no hints that the starter weapon was important, so I'd sold it at the beginning of the game. I didn't find out that I needed it until the end of the game - which really sucked. Along the same vein is the Zodiac Spear in FF12. All you had to do to lose your chance at the weapon was open a few chests. Way too easy to screw up and it's not something you'd know about unless you had a strategy guide.

Balancing a game around real money - Diablo 3. Many people will buy virtual items to get a head start or perhaps stay with everyone else in item progression, but it is all just a waste of money when a game should revolve around earning your items - not buying them. Why are you even playing the game if you plan on buying all the items and not earn any of it yourself? With that mentality you shouldn't ever play it and just throw your entire pay check to be top dog.

Diablo 3 isn't balanced around either of the AHs, but it still turned from and item hunt (D1 - D2) into a goldhunt, which is crap still.

I don't like things you can miss, but never repeat. Losing Shadow due to not waiting on the floating island in FF6, like Luna said, the Zodiac Spear in FF 12 (damn that one is reaaaally ed), any kind of location getting destroyed throughout the story holding something valuable you don't want to miss.

Post story end game secrets depending on something you did 5 mins into the game..."wait oh you didn't know that?"...well sorry, some door in a bonus dungeon locked for you!

But for your Banon example, that can be annoying, but only when handled wrong. He is always weak, always the same lvl, no matter of your own chars.

But you can equip him, put him in the back row, let him cast his awesome heals and he can also guard. He doesn't really get one shot by our favourite octopus later.

By balance, I meant that you need to use it to progress, because it is much easier to get better gear that way than getting it yourself.

I also despise limited edition items, because if you're new you cannot experience it since you weren't around when it was available.

I know what you ment, but like i said, thats not true, none of the AHs are needed to progress, altho convenience strongly suggest at not doing so, that is 100% true.

Hmm, limited editions don't bother me, alsong they aren't giving anything that can't be surpased in terms of power in the normal game.

Optional vanity goods don't hurt anyone.

RM games thinking that long pauses in their non-skippable dialogue is all fun and sexy.

I quit LPing their game for that nonsense.

Can't say that sounds like a fun concept that RATED-RKOFRANKLIN mentioned. I think I remember playing through those type of things and found them annoying but not like devastating annoying. For me having random encounters in the middle of hard puzzles makes me want to quit. But the most annoying thing I've found specifically in an RPG was in Suikoden III, there is an unbeatable boss fight. Right after the cutscene following you gain control of your party and well you can get into random encounters. But when the fight started all my characters had 1hp and the enemies were too tough and killed me before I could do anything to heal. There was zero indication that my party was in that condition (most rpgs auto heal you up after that kind of battle).... and because the game is normally relatively easy I hadn't saved for a very LONG time and pretty much raged quit on the spot. Never touched the game again. It really irked me and that's normally not like me. ^^;

Another thing that gets me frustrated is lack of direction. I hate circling around a place forever only to realize I had to hit enter on some rock or something and then I can progress in the game. I don't need my hand held but I do need it very clear what I should be doing at all times unless it's an open sandbox game and even then all the mini quests should have obvious directions. I hate flailing around trying to make something happen.

I personally like games that have limited party members you have to keep alive. It usually makes it impossible for button smashers to keep playing through blindly. I think it's one of the better concepts in a game.

I agree with limited edition content and the thing about the treasure chests though.

You get hyped by minutes long intro and then realize that the demo is not ready after that and tells you to come back later to play updated game which likely will not be finished. Problem is that I didn't get to do that "playing" part by controlling any character.

I completely agree with you. The Zodiac Spear is really the best example. Four random chests that you're not supposed to open, with no clues about that being the case. I assume it's all stuff put in in order to sell a strategy guide.

I've only had an issue with this in tactical rpg's as for the whole banon ordeal I was more sorry to see him go than i was having him along.

40 man raids in Wold of Warcraft :3

All rhythm based mechanics in battle, when I play an RPG I want an RPG not DDR.

Oh, you mean Banon, the most OP character in the game? Banon, the character who has a free all party heal? Banon, the character who makes leveling the entire group to 99 overnight on the river possible (assuming you have a turbo controller)? Banon is the sweetest character ever... you were just under-leveled.

On topic: I agree with you in principal. A better example (IMO) is BOF II when you get to Highfort and are forced to use God-Awful Sten as your only party member!. So what do you end up doing the first time you play this game? Sitting in that damn basement leveling forever because you can't leave the town or get your party back. Then you have to fight a semi-boss with Sten alone... and then run through the basement to get your party back as fast as possible hoping you don't die. It can take a long time to get strong enough to beat him. Pain in the ass....

but that's Sten's fault for being a ty character. Who in their right mind would want to play as some dirty circus monkey with awful attack and awful magic.

That actually brings up the worst RPG concept, at least imo. If you have a cast of multiple members and are allowed to choose who goes into your party, do not make it mandatory to have certain party members in your party at certain times. It's just awful

I 200% agree with this, because I remember as a kid playing this game and my only save point was with sten before you fight that other monkey on the bridge and it was impossible, thus I quit playing the game frustrated after all those hours wasted. (Dont insult me, remember this was as a young kid)

On a side note its good to see u again Biged, still rockin the badass cecil!