Shapeshifter as a main character, need for other characters?

● ARCHIVED · READ-ONLY
Started by Traveling Bard 10 posts View original ↗
  1. I was playing/beating breath of fire 1 yesterday and got an idea from Karn(the game's shapeshifter). 

    I thought that an interesting idea might be to have a shapeshifting main character that can shift seamlessly between turns into forms that are needed for battles. I was also thinking that attacks in one form would lead into another form, ex. flying form -> ox form = Meteor Dive! lol I thought up several forms that would pretty much be everything a team would need to fight with, but in having such a jack of all trades...would it be necessary to have other characters? 

    I am pretty sure I could whip up some complimenting characters, like perhaps an outcast witch, a half human half demon, a monk that was sent to exorcise the demon(the demon & the main character who is mistaken for a demon) but eventually becomes a part of the group, the father of the main character as a hunter type character that hunts him down at first but eventually joins him(he hunts him because he thinks that he is a demon that killed his son and assumed his son's form but eventually realizes that he is indeed his son), and possibly a knight(why not?) the point of the matter is, would it be overkill? Would it be more fun to control only one character, have these other minor characters in the story line that act to an extent in battle(like they punch or shoot an arrow giving you an opening but they aren't actually in your control), and just play it that way?

    The reason I hesitate is because the main is such an overwhelmingly powerful jack of all trades, the other characters would seem quite plain in comparison. I could probably give them cool/unique abilities but wouldn't they just be echoed in the main character anyway? What I don't want to do is to be like Breath of Fire 1 where Karn's shifting abilities and Ryu's dragon abilities pretty much made the battles and the remaining six characters were forgotten....several of which made up Karn's form which is like the ultimate "meh, was there even any other characters than Karn, Ryu, Nina, and Bleu?". Bleu had her magic arsenal which did well but she was no Puka or Rudra. Don't get me started on Agni and the face rolling that won me the last 4 boss battles in the game. 

    My question is this: In having a powerful jack of all trades shapeshifter, is it a good idea to have more playable characters in a standard team way? Or should I keep it single playable character that has storyline friends/allies that may impact certain battles but will not actively participate in a standard team way? Thoughts, comments? 
  2. I've always seen "Jack of All Trades" characters as not being the best at any one role. If you're going to make him super powerful in all categories, then of course he's going to overshadow more specialized characters. There should be a trade off for having so many options in one kit (character).

    I think it also depends on just how many forms you're talking about and how they relate to the other mechanics in your battle system. If he has 3 forms, for instance, how much ground does that really cover? In some games, having 3 forms/classes/whatever may not cover as much of the game's systems while in another, having 3 forms makes a character capable of doing anything.

    Also, how central to your game do you want your main character's shapeshifting to be? If you want it to be the main mechanic in your game, then you will want to focus on it and make that the center of your combat. You can either ditch party members entirely or make them more supportive/supplementary such as Donald and Goofy in Kingdom Hearts. If it's just something that you want your main character to do, but not make it a real focus, then you'd probably want to balance it with your other party members.
  3. My idea would see about 8 different forms for the character. It's sort of the main idea of the story. The character is different from others, doesn't belong among monsters or humans but ultimately finds a sense of pride in himself for being unique and attempts to open people's minds to being ok about being different. This opens a path to peace between species or at the very least an understanding. 

    Gameplay-wise, these different forms all have their special abilities/quirks but also glaring weaknesses. The weaknesses make it so that you have to switch between them throughout battle in order to not get whooped and at the same time certain forms are necessary to break through resistances or lead into combinations. I think I could do alot in battles with just one character, which is what this could be. I think we are both leaning toward the same idea here in that having the main character do most of the heavy lifting so to speak but to have minor characters do what they do just not in a playable character sense, if for nothing else just to keep things interesting or highlight the main character.
  4. Maybe the first chunk of the story can have him at full (but reduced overall) power.  Then, maybe a powerful boss, as its Final Blow, blocks the main character from entering certain forms.    This would effectively cripple him in battle.  In turn, this forces the player to find people he can trust, but must earn their trust in turn.

    This would also be the main character's crisis of self, perhaps.  Maybe the main character feels powerless and weak...

    And, in the end, maybe the main character, with help from his other party members, break the block by forcing the main character to evolve, into a type of Super Shapeshifter who has all of the forms he had initially, but at much a higher strength.

    And they all go off to fight the Final Boss. Said boss would be game balanced to require the main character AND all party members at full strength...

    Of course, many would still not trust and could not trust the main character.  So it's not a total victory, but the character can find a few True Companions along the way.
  5. @whitesphere, pretty much nail on the head of what I was thinking about doing. Bad guys would be people that can change into dragons(reverse BoF lol) that fear the power of the beast king(the ultimate form of the shifter...I'm not good with names of things so forgive me for the cliche') and throughout the course of their run for world domination(humans and monsters) our boy stands in their way. I see a boss battle where the beast king form will be used to knock the dragon down a peg or two, which up to this point damage couldn't be dealt to dragons by ANY species, but then taken away in some sealing technique mid-battle. This would force the player to actually use some other means to finish the dragon off with help from the other characters storyline wise and some creative combinations.
  6. I wouldn't place too much effort on originality at this point.  The most important thing is the story is well-told, and the game is fun to play.  The latter is by far the hardest part, with game balance being key. Playtesting is definitely key here.   And, if you are using a very different gameplay mechanic, it's important to ease the players into how to use it effectively.  After all, a shapeshifting mechanic is different from the more common RPG battle mechanics.  

    And, as you pointed out, it's essential to shapeshift mid-battle.  So I'd make the first areas ones where you only need to shapeshift once.  Or, perhaps put the initial sequence in as the main character's dream, which would explain why he won't die, but won't proceed until he wins the dream battle.
  7. For a shapeshifting character he has to have some sort of weakness in his transformations, lets take Chaos Legion for example: It is about a game where this guy can summon a legion of familiars at his will, in the beginning of the game he doesn't need a legion because he possessed the most powerful familiar known as Thanatos (Has no weakness can obliterate over 100 enemies within one attack call, Yes enemies come out in the hundreds in hard mode) he had to most powerful familiar he could just literary walk all badass in the middle of the battlefield and let Thanatos deal with all the enemies. ANYWAYS at the end of the 1st chapter the dude loses Thanatos and it's soul is shattered and scattered throughout the world in which you have to find but now you are forced to work with your weaker legion familiars which are, Sword, Archer, Claw, Shield, Cannon. Each of these familiars have their own strong points and weak points and you have to change legions everytime you encounter an enemy that is strong against a certain legion, it works the same way as a Shapeshifting character, even though he/she is a jack of all trades you have to give each of his forms a weakness to balance him out from all the other characters so he/she can't overshadow them.
  8. I still wish there was a clear distinguishing word for shapeshifters who have various forms, and shapeshifters who have potentially infinite forms.

    By potentially infinite I mean someone who can shift into pretty much any form. Like say, Mystique, Clayface, Envy...

    Anyway, since you mentioned Breath of Fire, in the third entry, Ryu has a boatload of Dragon forms. As you combine 1-3 genes to get a form, there's lots of combinations. Ryu's...rather strong anyway, and he has tons of powerful, versatile dragon forms, and...whenever he switches to a new dragon form it's at full health...But the other party members are still useful. Sometimes they are relegated to back-up, but back-up is certainly welcome.

    So, umm, I'll look at this in a different perspective. If you are gonna have a solo adventure, a shapeshifter would be an awesome choice for the role. But a shapeshifter (either with various or near infinite forms) would still make a fun main character with a team.
  9. One way to handle him is implementing weaknesses to each form.  Not just sucking at magic or strength attacks, but actual weaknesses that can result in death.  If the party needs to watch out for this glass cannon superman, he still needs supporters to keep him going.

    I wouldn't be too worried about him being so much more powerful though.  Chrono was easily better than anyone else, and can you imagine playing FF7 without Cloud?  There's a number of RPGs where a character vastly outmatches all others and he's usually the hero of the game.  It's okay as long as he can't do it all alone and needs some help sometimes.  He can only take so many actions and sometimes that's just not enough to keep afloat.
  10. Have you played Persona 3 or Persona 4 by any chance? 

    Because those games are essentially balanced around the whole "Shapeshifter" thing, though it's thematically different. 

    In both those games the main character has the unique ability to switch his persona at will. (In 1&2, EVERYONE can, so it's a little different) 

    Without getting into the lore of it, functionally, your persona is a set of skills, stats and weakness/resistances bundled together. 

    All the supporting characters have one set persona (granted, they can upgrade to new forms, but they still keep the same specializations)

    The main character can't get exact copies of his team-mates personas, but he can get access to basically any skill his team can, and in the end, is better than all of them at everything. 

    You're a way better healer than your healers, a way better attacker than your main damage dealers, a way better tank than your damage sponge, 

    but for the most part, you can't be all three at the same time. 

    The thing is, even with all that, the enemies are so damn hard you can't handle them alone.

    And on the flipside, the enemies weakness, abilities and tactics needed to defeat them very so wildly that the game becomes insanely difficult without using the persona switching mechanic.

    So, a shapeshifing character that can fill any role is pretty much going to have the be the linchpin that battles are planned and balanced around, and his party members are basically going to be regulated to being support, but if you want them to feel useful, then make sure that support is vital for success. Though, I should note that balancing your game in this fashion may result in a pretty difficult game. 

    Still, if you haven't played either Persona 3 or Persona 4, I'd recommend trying one of them out to see if it gives you some ideas for how to balance your own shapeshifiting main character. (plus they're good RPGs anyway)