Class systems

Ok, something that I have been toying with as an idea. I would like opinions from folks. I love leveling classes in an rpg and upgrading classes - it gives a certain choice snd pleasure for me. Ie adept to cleric to either a bishop or a necromancer. But how many is enough or how many classes should there be in such a game? Can there be too many classes?

This leads to how uniquely can one make/name classes without loosing the understandable idea? I would love lots of thought on all this and or extra input otherwise. I am doing my best to not be overly ambitious but it doesn't hurt to throw feelers out there!

I enjoy class and skill choice myself in rpgs. I believe there can be too many classes, particularly when classes cease to fill a unique role in the party. The major paradigms for MMORPGs are the tank (high hp/high defense), healer, and DPSer (i.e. damage per second or nuker). D & D 4th edition had 4 roles for the classes, including Defender (the tank), Leader (healer/buffer), Striker (glass-cannon, i.e. high damage/low hp), and Controller (debuffer and area damage). You can have hybrid classes as well (tank/healer, striker/leader, etc). Have each class fulfill a role, but remember, balance is important. If one class is too powerful, a player won't explore the other options. Consider how Square handled FF1. There were 6 classes to choose from, and the traditional "balanced" group was a fighter (tank), thief (fast attacker), white mage (healer/buffer), and black mage (debuffer/area damage). The monk and red mage fulfilled specialized roles: monk became super damager, and red mage had access to some of both magic types.

The tutorials section has a nice Game Design Document (excel spreadsheet) which can help you plan out your classes (characters) et al.

Right now, I am using the D&D classes as inspiration for my current project.

There are plenty of good games with class trees and such. It all depends on what type of game you're looking to make.

First things first, this script may be of use to you:
http://yanflychannel.wordpress.com/rmvxa/core-scripts/class-system/

The two addons may also be useful depending on what your going with.



Option A: Class Trees
The best example of a class tree has to be Ragnarok Online. I've done something similar for a game before.

With this system, you either want to make a class tree for each character or only have the class tree available for the main character. If you want true customizability, you can also make a single class tree for all characters. Classes tend to number about 8 to 10 per a tree.


Option B: Class unlocking
Similar to the class tree, this is is best see in the Final Fantasy Tactics games (Although I like to pretend that the advance ones don't exist and the series only exists with the PS1 game and it's PSP port). Play a class long enough, it unlocks one or more new classes. All classes are balanced together and even a starting class has its uses late into the game. This system is the hardest due to having to balance. This is best used in Tactical RPGs and the classes tend to range between 10 and 20, if not more.

Option C: Class leveling
This is best seen in Final Fantasy 3 and Final Fantasy 5, where classes are unlocked as the story progresses and you can equip the class and level it to make it stronger. This best works if you're making a game where the story wont be affected by the class of the characters. Generally, I'd keep the classes around 12 for this type of system


Hope that helps.

If you like D&D, you can do the multi-classing thing, where a single character can have multiple base classes, like a Warrior/Mage.

I think there are too many classes in a game if the classes don't seem unique.  It's fine to have 4 Fighter classes, if, say one is a bare-handed Monk (fast but light defense), one is a beefy Knight (slow, high defense), one is a Rogue (fast, medium defense and has a lot of Rogue-specific abilities), and one is a Blood Knight (like a Knight but all techniques take from the player's HP)

If two classes pretty much play the same and there's no real significant difference between them, there's no reason for them both to be there.

Even if you have classes which unlock at higher levels, the classes should still be unique in some significant ways, particularly from the less advanced class.

The key is to offer real player choice, without offering a ton of barely different choices. 

Also, keep in mind the more classes you offer, the harder it gets to balance the game so that players aren't effectively forced to choose a particular class.  "Oh, my Blood Knight is powerful and look, my Bard can keep the Blood Knight topped up in HP!  And I can have my Knight protect them both!"

First, thanks so much for all of your imput that you have given. I see there really is more to

It than I first realized. As a D&Der from 3.5 - it got crazy with so many choices and archtypes but I really liked that. So much uniqueness can be had!

You bring up very good points voymasa and whitesphete thank you! Additionally Another thanks TimmyTheNerd. I had no idea that you could really structure the way you can have classes. I haven't got to the point of game making yet but thanks for the script and the clear explanation of the different ways to do that!

Anyone else have opinons in general as well?

Make sure your classes and game features flow from your story, rather than the other way around.  With all of the nifty scripts it's very easy to get caught up in feature-itis.   Instead, focus on the story you want to tell in your game and what features make solid sense in the story.

For example, a crafting system makes perfect sense for a Harvest Moon clone, since crafting, farming and relationships are the main focus of the game.

But it might not make much sense in a survival horror game, unless the goal is "Find harmless pieces and assemble them into a weapon to use to kill the psycho who is stalking you."

And a good thing to remember is to give each class its flaws and vulnerabilities, not just strengths. This way, the player has to use strategy in assigning classes to the party.

I made a comment but I guess I just reanimated a dead thread.

And the necromancy award goes to... ME!

@fireflyege Yep, 3 and a bit years. Not bad!